[Feedback] Nerf-Buff Phobies: Which Ones and What to Change

Hey all! I am creating this new ongoing feedback thread to know which Phobies we need to nerf or buff, and what, so our design team can regularly check this thread to know your thoughts about this.

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I thnk:
Nerf Smother mother attack
Buff Thundre rocks attack to no-mechanical phobies
Nerf Cerberus life
and buff Finnigan’s attack

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I agree with some of these, with others I don’t.
For Smother Mother I guess she’s a top tier unit so you could make an argument for nerfing her, but I feel like there are more powerful ones such as Beauty or Chuck which are better IMO)

Thunder Rocks I absolutely agree with, it feels absolutely atrocious into any opponent who’s not playing a full mech team (and even against those it’s not like it’s insanely powerful, just rather good) - I would suggest doing something like making both it’s normal attack 350 and it’s electrical 350 too as a start (it would still be doing the same to mechanical units then, but would still be somewhat useable against non-mech’s. You could maybe even make both 375 or just leave the electrical damage at 400 if you want to buff it - All of these are level 1 stats ofc). Kind of sad that it’s so bad too since it’s attack animation is pretty cool.

Cerberus I’ve never really had trouble with since you can often just either poison him and run away or kite him around the map whilst slowly wearing him down. Might just be me though since I’ve seen other complain about it (I think it might be because it kind of fucks Eratic up which for a lot of people is their go-to late unit on smaller maps for a long time - Maybe increasing it’s rarity so that you see it less early on could be a solution).

Finnigan I completely disagree with, it’s usable on a large amount of maps where you can either push enemies into lava, off panic points or stim pad - And on maps with pits it’s literally the highest potential 2-drop in the game since it can push enemies off the map (also works really well with other pushes, especially the AOE pushers Rambolina and Heavo 2.0 since it becomes super hard to position against)

IMO they should mostly be buffing phobies rather than nerfing them since nerfing phobies feels quite bad for players that own those phobies (especially since it’s a form of collecting game where you don’t own everything, so having any of your go-to phobies nerfed can be really bad).
Having one of your phobies buffed on the other hand is a nice feeling and makes you more likely to experiment with using it (which in turn makes players try out more stuff).
If I absolutely had to nerf something it would probably be Beauty (but it should be a minor nerf like a slight hit to attack or hp, not something that makes it bad).

As for phobies I would buff the list is rather long, but all of the Jackalope could do with either a bit more hp, attack or more payoff for using them together.
Hi-Five and Russel could each use some buffs too (Russel only needs a bit more hp in my opinon, Hi-Five could do with both health and attack or maybe even a rework)
Bad Sushi is just not good in my opinion (some might even say that he’s bad) and needs a rework (the only way to ever realistically get it close to an enemy is by using Paddles and even then it’s not that easy - Also bad to be locked behind having Paddles since Paddles is a rare so a lot of people don’t own him)
Charon could do with a bit more attack (he’s very cool in theory, but feels underwhelming in game)
Rusty I think could use a buff or rework too - but not sure how to do it. (it feels too weak right now, in order for it to be good ATM you essentially have to catch a highish key melee enemy phobie with it and then beat it up with ranged phobies without your opponent retaliating - Not very realistic)
There are also a ton of other ones that could use minor buffs, but these are the ones that stand out the most to me.

4 Likes

I think most of @ManInYellow 's points are similar to how I currently feel about the units that need a buf. Mostly Bad Sushy, Hi-five, thunderocks and the jackelopes.

Charon is ok… I mean, if you use him for point control (disabling enemy points and retreat) I’ve won a few times doing that with him.

Cerberus is easy to counter. nerfing him will actually making him too weak. 1 move melee units need high damage or they will never be viable.

IMO Beauty is OP. Its HP + damage gets really high, combined with a healer to keep it going. Its brutal. I’ve tried to counter it with Smiley (my goto dimentional killer) but that hasent been successful here yet. Compared to other 8 keys units, I find them all fairly easy to counter/kill, while Beauty requires a lot of work. Also beauty requires little strategy to use. One solution here could be to make Beauty a 9 key unit.

4 Likes

Might just be because I haven’t seen Charon used enough, but I’ve never really seen it do something super useful.

Beauty is obviously a bit too strong, but I think that it might seem a bit stronger than it is since a large amount of the time when your opponent uses it the level of the Beauty is not even close to be equal to your teams level (it’s often level 17-19 in my experience) which makes it seem even more powerful.
The few times I’ve faced off against players that have a Beauty at level 8-10 (which is around where my decent phobies are) I can actually threaten to kill it and have a chance - But when the Beauty has like 3386 health (lvl 19) there is not chance in hell I’m ever killing that thing (I’d be more likely to kill the enemy’s heart) and it deals damn near 700 AOE damage with every attack (and close to 800 with the line).
I feel like if they just give it +1 key it will be used in the exact same way and will still cause the same kinds of problems - But if they instead make it a bit squishier so that it’s killable or lower it’s offensive power so that it doesn’t obliterate your entire team in no time it might actually be beatable.
Still I’d prefer it costing 9 keys rather than 8 if that was the way they chose. :stuck_out_tongue:

Out of curiosity have you ever tried using Fowl on it? I feel like it might be able to do something since it’s disease is decent (slightly stronger than Smiley’s?) and it’s actually mobile enough to catch Beauty (which I imagine would be hard with Smiley). Can’t really test it myself since my stress level is way too low for that (don’t even have Snowballl yet, so there’s still a bit to go for Fowl) :slight_smile:

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Actually, no I have not used fowl against Beauty, but I’ve been meaning to try using it more. I guess I have the same issue as you with Beauty being level 15 -19 on average, and my opponent often waits until the very end to pull him out, probably to make sure I dont have enough keys to bring out something like Fowl. Its a bit of a risk too, (the waiting game), not pulling anything and sitting on 7 keys. I’ve also tried using ice units againts it with no real success. I think a reason I like using smiley is because AoE units will hit him, so long as he is touching the target unit.

IMO an issue here is that we are both really high on leaderboard. So our opponents that use Beauty are also decently skilled enough to know how to keep it alive. (tag a healer with it, use Snowball to untaw it from ice, etc)

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I agree that beauty should be toned down. It’s not even just that high-ranked players use it so much, more like the other way around - i think some players rank high because they happen to own a high-level beauty. It can go on every terrain, has high hp, poison doesn’t counter it 'cause it can be healed and positioning to avoid the beam can be a nightmare. Like, at least don’t let these shots go through cover. Nothing else does. (I guess it’s fine when blast-o-matic does it 'cause that unit can’t move around so much to find the perfect spot to shoot from.)

Stabby could well be nerfed too. It’s pretty rare that it doesn’t end up trading for more (sometimes much more) than its 3 key cost what with all the small wounds it spreads around which are inefficient to heal yet can make phobies much easier to gang up on. That’s on top of its own attack and death rattle damage, which are anything but insignificant. Voodo damage down to 25% and slightly less hp would be my suggestion. BoMangles comes to mind as well, but counterplay is more readily available there and without retaliation damage the lack of mobility / reach is definitely a bigger downside overall.

Lastly, Alastor always overperforms against me, though i’m not sure if that’s just a leveling issue. Esp. on small maps with healing pools though it can utterly dominate the endgame if its user knows what he’s doing (i.e. always poking, never allowing it to be killed in 1 turn).

As for buffs, i’ve recently pulled hi-five and it always ends up sitting in my roster, looking a me. It’s 8 keys for what basically plays like and has stats in line with Sheeping Gas (double hp for double key cost, same attack value, no poison, but life leech). Could its movement go to 3 while its attack value is lowered a bit? That would make it actually threatening.

Sushi, misanthrope and thunder rocks are all pretty bad 3-cost units imo. Maybe sushi wouldn’t be if paddles wasn’t so expensive. Paddles should cost 3 keys btw. Would also help Cerberus and Hydra, which I never found all that dangerous even with these massive stats (though they are not so bad they need a buff i think).
Thunder Rocks is a very lopsided unit and fairly easy to position away from since it’s melee. So all that electrical damage pretty much never even connects. Would be better if the ratio of regular : electrical wasn’t so extreme that non-mechanical phobies can almost ignore it (currently it’s 2:5 with a base damage lower than any 1-key, except Henrietta).
Misantrophe doesn’t hit hard enough. It’s just a bigger cowbell, without the cheapness that makes cowbell occasionally useful.

I’ve had games where rusty was useful, but it could still easily cost 1 key imo.

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-For me, nerf klepto, he is super strong with lob AOE basic attack with only 6 key. He is always scared me compared with heavo 2.0. make him 7 key would be great and he Will still viable

-Cut the mouse family from 4 to 2, and change the other 2 become something else
(Cotten tale and jackalope king are couple 2 keys ressurrect ground phobies with same ability, change mopsy and flopsy into couple 3 keys ressurrect flying phobies with same ability).

-and i do agree with beauty, he is extremely strong

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nerf stabby, too many kit for 3 key unit either increase his health and cost by 1 or decrease his damage

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Hey there

For my first post here I’ll say please nerf Stabby

Make him a 4key with either less dmg or less hp, or even both!!!

Early game it’s very hard to counter/gangbang him

Even when Im able
to poison him, he gets the healer to save him

He’s way to hard to kill for a 3 key phobie

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I think stabby is OK no need to nerf(if needed from 30% to 25% ) , he matches the req of other 3 key unit like bo mangles and spud . BUff charon(50-100 damage /200-300 health ) , russel (melee ,needs a health buff 400-500) honeybear , finningan(50 damage as his push ability which does not req cooldown for 2 cost , so don’t necessarily need a buff) , kaboom (compared to kerbloom which has Aoe push , kaboom is costly ,and damage diff is 500 only ) misanthrope needs a damage buff , Hi-
five
needs a health buff or (100 damage buff ) (Klepto needs a damage nerf) . thunder rock needs damage buff .

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Buff octo naughty’s health and attack

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Not really related to nerfs or buffs but please add more quests and special tiles

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Add more low key phobies that have ability to leaving a lava tile like snowball to counter annoying dimensional, espessially stabby, its only snowball that could counter stabby efficiently, and new player doesnt have access to it.
Because for me, the best counter to dimensional isnt a poison, but lava tile.
The disease phobies is way to costly.

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Im totally agree with you

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buff: Boom, Kerbloom, Rusty, Charon, Honey Bear and Heart Breaker
nerf: Stabby, Snowball, Smiley, Fetch, Zappy, Cerberus, Boofairy and Heavo 2.0

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plz make jill an uncommon card , it hurts too much when you grind weeks for 800 pack and unlock jill .

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I honestly think hydra needs a slight re-tune. It’s a bit too efficient for its cost, even with the 1 movement limitation and punishes anyone without a counter on small maps. I’d say either bump it to 5 keys or bring down its attack a bit and let it just be a damage sponge.

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I think beauty is too good she is the best 8 key phobie , she got everything aoe on normals , can fly, high health , insane laser. When all these features come together it makes her very unpredictable. I think she needs adjustments more than just simple increasing and decreasing value nerfs. I think the rareness of disease phobies is also makes her so good. And poison is not good enough weakness as it can be cured easily.

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